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Thank you to Newtek.

Par kidgkodiak
Just wanted to give you all a big round of applause and thanks for your hard work to each and every one of the people at Newtek for the latest NDI release today. You guys came at the perfect time and while most of the Newtek staff here are usually hounded by questions, I hope this message gets to your team. Again, thank you for doing all that you are to keep us (and definitely from us working from home) afloat during these hard times.

Cheers to your team, and stay safe folks.

Ndi 4.5

Par kanep
NDI Tools 4.5 has been released for Windows and Macintosh. Updated NDI Analysis and SDK, the Unreal Engine NDI SDK is now available.

Here is a (very) partial list of improvements from the SDK docs. This release is under the hood improvements, NDI Tools operate as they did before.

* Significant improvement to UDP sender that should dramatically improve the performance on many systems and networks. This should reduce the CPU time, and also get far better network efficiency.

* At 1080p60 the number of channels of decoding possible on Windows should increase when you have a larger number of cores available.

* Lower latency in all forms of HX decoding. This is at least 2 frames better in almost all cases and in many it will be better than that.

* Vastly improved startup discovery performance on Windows.

* Quite a large improvement to codec quality.

* Fix for problem with right clicking when using Scan Converter and KVM.

* NDI now uses predictable port numbers in all cases so that fire-wall rules can be properly built.
- Each connection uses TCP ports 5960 and up.
- Each mTCP or UDP receiver use port 6960 and up.
- Each mTCP or UDP sender use port 7960 and up.

http://ndi.tv

NDI and Avid Media Composer Across VLANS

Par justsomeguy
Hi All,

Here's my problem: I'm trying to give multiple end users the ability to use Studio Monitor to watch down the output of multiple Avid Media Composer's running NDI Open NDI plugin. To be clear, i want them to be able to select from a list of roughly 50 machines, to watch one of them, using the monitor. My network is not multicast nor mDNS enabled. My end users are on different VLANS than the Media Composers. For reference, I'm using MC 2018.12 and NDI Tools v4.0 on monitor endpoints.

1) Avid Media Composer does not seem to have a place to configure the Open i/o NDI plugin in order to point it at a Discovery Server (anyone know of a way?) so i can't use a discovery server implementation.

2) I've resorted to Access Manager on the NDI Monitor end point. Im able to manually add the sources in the access manager for the multiple machines and they all work (hooray).

3) Access manager stores it's config in several places.
ndi-config.v1.json in C:\ProgramData\NewTek\NDI
a registry key called "IPs" in HKEY_USERS\-username-\Software\NDI\Networks where -username- is the Administrative or Power user that last launched the Access Manager app

The last point there is something i need to flag, because its important for the next one. Access Manager can only be ran (on windows 10 anyway) by a user that has Power User or Administrative privileges on that machine. If the end user that needs the monitor is not an Admin or Power user, an Administrator needs to configure the access manager and then their use of Studio Monitor will then reference the config put in by the windows Administrative user that did the setup.

What I've found is that neither of the above Configs actually take any precedent in the "Remote Sources" tab. I've tried to manually add Source IPs (comma,separated) to both the RegKey as well as the JSON file. When I next launch the Access Manager application and update the config, both the JSON file and the Registry Key are overwritten by the application upon closing.

So that got my wheels spinning and I realized there must be another config somewhere. Sure enough, there is. That config is called ndiMemos.xml and lives here: %USERPROFILE%\AppData\Roaming\NewTek where %username% is again, the Admin or PowerUser that configured the Access Manager. I was able actually to manually modify that file, which is great. But I still have this problem with Access Manager needing to be ran as a Power/Admin user because unfortunately many of my users are not Power/Admin on their own machines.


So, here's my ask 1) In the long term, is there any way Access Manager can be properly signed so any user can run it? 2) Is there an easy way to do this? I'm thinking a webserver inside of my environment that "Catches" all the media composer feeds over NDI and Aggregates them into a WebPage so an end user can simply hit that webserver over p443 and click a Source to view it in the browser (html5 video). Does anything like that exist out there?


Thanks all

Newtek NDI 4.5

Par LeCollagiste
Newtek NDI

Le groupe Vizrt propriétaire de Newtek créateur du protocole NDI depuis 2015, annonce la venue du NDI 4.5.

Dans les tuyaux de cette nouvelle mouture, des fonctionnalités avancées pour l’utilisation d’Internet et du réseau sans fil, le NDI|HX avec faible latence, un support complet de l’accélération du décodage GPU, l’intégration du NDI|HX dans la caméra autonome Mevo. La possibilité de diffuser sur son réseau NDI, des flux en temps réel d’Unreal Engine, laissant le champ libre pour l’augmentée et la réalité virtuelle. L’enregistrement IP illimité sur la version 4.5

NDI Tools est une suite gratuite de friandises conçues pour un flux de travail vidéo sur le réseau.

NDI Tools

NDI

Newtek NDI 4.5 est un billet de LeCollagiste VJ.
LeCollagiste VJ - Mag du LeCollagiste, actu sur la culture VJING, Vidéo Mapping, info video et high tech.

Advanced Edition 3 no longer supports iVGA - Need help

Par isaac2k2
We recently upgraded out Tricaster 8000 to the latest Advanced Edition 3 firmware and we lost ability to display our Easyworship via ivga to traicaster.

I have read about the NDI solution and installed it on the desktop and setup everything but I have facing a challenge with this new system.

The laptop main screen is captured on Tricaster as a feed but no where to force it to display the secondary screen which is where we project our scriptures to external monitors.

The old ivga had a setting that allows you to select which screen but this new one does not have such option hence we are stuck.

Anyone able to assist.

Thanks

Can't Get NDI Studio Monitor to record a feed with alpha channel

Par avkid6345
I'm struggling with studio monitor this morning with Studio Monitor and IsoCorder. I have titles coming in from ProPresenter with an alpha channel. I can get it to display properly within Studio Monitor with the checkerboard background confirming that the alpha channel is working, but all recordings just have a black background. I can't find a way to get the iso feed from the titles recorded with alpha channel. Any obvious settings I'm missing? Is there a better NDI recording software out there?

NDI HX1 vs HX2

Par DStoneburner
is there an article that shows the improvements of HX2? Thanks in advance.

Magewell’s New Flexible 4K Decoder for NDI® And SRT To Be Launched at 2020 NAB Show

Par Andres Benetar

  Magewell will unveil its most powerful decoder hardware to date in booth # SU5724 at the 2020 NAB Show (April 19-22 in Las Vegas). Believed to be the industry’s first hardware decoder to support both Newtek’s NDI® technology for production-grade media transport and the Secure Reliable Transport (SRT) protocol – developed and open-sourced by ...

The post Magewell’s New Flexible 4K Decoder for NDI® And SRT To Be Launched at 2020 NAB Show appeared first on NAB Show News | 2020 NAB Show Media Partner and Producer of NAB Show LIVE. Broadcast Engineering News.

Powerpoint in Presenter Mode & Full Screen options?

Par Pasnow
Thinking out loud here, and for an external set of eyes & brain to help think something thru. We do conferences in a fairly large auditorium (100-200 ppl) about the size of a high school gym, but professional environment. Previously, we had out laptop at the podium, and speakers would use the clicker to cycle thru the slides. In between speakers tho we have our staff kinda walk up, fumble thru the laptop to close out the PPT and load up either a On Break set of slides, or maybe a promo or video. It's not terrible, but there's talk it looks a bit amatuerish, and we want to control the slides and projectors view from the back. (Also, some less savvy speakers wish to show a youtube video or something and have trouble bringing it up).

We use Wirecast, and have a Connect Spark. We are thinking of using the Powerpoint laptop in to the Connect Spark, and then Wirecast grabs it for our online viewers as Picture In Picture (this we currently do & is A Okay). Then place a laptop up front, and use Studio Monitor for the speaker to view the powerpoint. And from there, HDMI out to the projector.

However, inevitably, some speakers are going to need/want to see their PPT in Presenter View, and see notes about their speech. It is not our auditorium, and we only get in about 6:30am for an 8am start, and we do not have access to the projector from the back, its hanging high up & fixed, with the HDMI input cable at the front. If we send Presenter View to the podium via Studio Monitor, it then outputs Presenter View to the Projector. There seem to be things like Birddog Mini however if the Powerpoint HDMIs out Full Screen to it, likely it will full screen to the podium.

Logistically, can anyone conceive a way to pull this off? We're thinking some form of screenshare (GotoAssist) for the podium to view the PPT Laptops Presenter View screen, while HDMI out is Full Screen to the Monitor. Or, maybe via OBS using NDI.
Lastly, 2 laptops with NDI Scan Converter on would not see each other, right?

NDI Studio no video but has audio

Par RCJ
This is a weird one. Reminds me of when we had to change the .ini file to get overlay to work. Computer Specs below
NDI Studio Ver 4 loads the studio and receives audio, but only shows green screen on video. I'm simply trying to display our NDI output on a local computer on the same Gigabit LAN. Could not get VLC to decode, but suspect it has encode and no decode. Maybe someone knows how to get VLC to decode and display.

So Studio has sound and green screen for video
NDI test pattern Ver 4 crashes with the following error:
Problem signature:
Problem Event Name: APPCRASH
Application Name: Application.Network.TestPatterns.exe
Application Version: 1.0.0.0
Application Timestamp: 5e45db8b
Fault Module Name: Processing.NDI.Lib.x64.dll
Fault Module Version: 4.1.6.0
Fault Module Timestamp: 5e45db06
Exception Code: c000001d
Exception Offset: 0000000000bab64a
OS Version: 6.1.7601.2.1.0.256.1
Locale ID: 1033
Additional Information 1: 16a6
Additional Information 2: 16a64011e9427dfff697afa4c86d841b
Additional Information 3: a4c8
Additional Information 4: a4c8bb0ef04e858c1479ab66be8c00c1

***********
Tried Ver 3.6 NDI Tools and get test pattern to another machine for 20+ hours, but Studio 3.6 crashes with this error:
Problem signature:
Problem Event Name: APPCRASH
Application Name: Application.Network.StudioMonitor.x64.exe
Application Version: 3.6.0.0
Application Timestamp: 5b580b37
Fault Module Name: Application.Network.StudioMonitor.x64.exe
Fault Module Version: 3.6.0.0
Fault Module Timestamp: 5b580b37
Exception Code: c000001d
Exception Offset: 000000000053fdcb
OS Version: 6.1.7601.2.1.0.256.1
Locale ID: 1033
Additional Information 1: 1ee0
Additional Information 2: 1ee092440bf7aac5428f9257921782a1
Additional Information 3: b72b
Additional Information 4: b72b6fc4d6af5792c99d216a12a03bf2
************
Cleaned everything out and tried several things nothing allows it to display the video. Updated all drivers, no virus, no malware, no spyware, nothing unusual, DX updated, very basic setup. Output to one external monitor, not using laptop monitor on Dell D620

System: Win 7 Ultimate SP1 all updates, turned off everything I didn't need. Plenty of HD space, and swap space set to 5Gb on separate partition.
CPU Intel Mobile Core 2 Duo T7200 @2.0 GHz, 4096 KB cache, MMX, SSE, SSE2, SSE3, SSSE3, EMT 64, VT-x
CPU 12%, Physical RAM 50%, network .35%
GPU Nvidia Quadro NVS 110M, Memory 128 MB actual; used dedicated 19MB, Dynamic 25MB

RAM 2x 2GB = 4GB
Gigabit Ethernet to a switch to the other PC, running almost the same specs, but RAM 16Gb and CPU i7. Network is empty except for these two devices.

Any ideas on how to get Studio monitor 4 to display the video?
Thanks

Scan Converter closes during use

Par tellusmuseum
I am running a PowerPoint on a Windows 10 machine through scan converter into a Tricater TC-1. The two are connected through a local Gigabit switch along with a NCIO, worksurface, and five Newtek PTZ cameras. I am getting freezing through the NDI input every once in a while on the Tricaster. The screen isn't frozen on the Windows 10 machine, just the input into the TC-1. Today, when I checked, the scan converter plug in must have had closed during the PowerPoint. I restarted the plug in, and once again I could see the PC.

Any thoughts?

A way to build with FFmpeg?

Par sneakyjoe
I've recently got interested in building my server with NDI-Nginx-FFmpeg transcoding for my stream. I learned that around a year ago FFMpeg stopped NDI support.
It also looks like FFmpeg even of older versions won't build with NDI SDK? (I also assume I may have been doing something wrong)
Is there a static build of FFmpeg to use on ubuntu or even in Windows, or a way to build FFmpeg myself for personal usage?

NDI stutter

Par imryh
Hello.

We have a large NDI setup with a new TC Mini 4K in the middle of it. All camera sources (6) are coming into the TC Mini 4K using BirdDog Studios.

Every single camera source is coming up on the TC Mini has a light video stutter every 10-12 seconds.

Any ideas why, and how to fix it?

All on a local network. Lots of bandwidth.

Thanks.

Imry

Mage Noir : six illustrateurs dévoilent leurs créations pour un jeu de cartes

Par Shadows

Camille Fourcade, Charles Ouvrard, Jessica Heran, Jeffrey Jeanson, Nicolas Camiade et Johann Goutard dévoilent leurs créations pour Mage Noir, un projet de jeu de cartes à jouer et collectionner. Ce dernier, porté par les game designers Vincent Vimont et Constantin Dedeyan, fait l’objet d’une campagne Kickstarter.

En voici une petite sélection :

Jessica Heran
Johann Goutard
Charles Ouvrard
Jeffrey Jeanson
Camille Fourcade
Nicolas Camiade

D’autres visuels sont visibles sur le site du projet et la page Kickstarter. Le jeu comportera bien évidemment de nombreuses autres artworks, puisque chaque pack starter comportera 80 cartes et que des boosters sont prévus.
On notera d’ailleurs que 45% de la somme demandée pour la campagne correspond, justement, à la création des artworks et donc à la rémunération des artistes.

L’article Mage Noir : six illustrateurs dévoilent leurs créations pour un jeu de cartes est apparu en premier sur 3DVF.

Facebook NDI Users Group

Par joly
For those that might like such things.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/ndiusers/

Not-affiliated with Newtek, public, 4.4k users.

Powerpoint & presenter view

Par dveldhouse
This one seems strange to me, so hoping someone has an idea why. When I connect my laptop to my Mini for recording a PPT, we can't seem to make it work correctly with the presenter view. The standard presentation looks fine on the laptop, but on the Mini and on the pass-through to a projector, the slides are squished top and bottom. The display drivers are fine and are set correctly as far as I can see. There is no problem with the standard presentation view, but some people really like to see their notes when talking. Any thoughts or am I missing something simple?

TIA

Callipeg : un outil d’animation 2D prometteur a besoin de vous

Par Shadows

L’équipe d’Enoben nous présente son projet en cours : Callipeg, un outil d’animation pensé pour l’iPad.

L’objectif est ambitieux : il s’agit ni plus ni moins que de proposer un produit convenant aux professionnels. L’équipe insiste aussi sur sa volonté de s’appuyer au maximum sur les capacités de l’iPad : Apple Pencil, gestes sont donc pleinement supportés.

En beta depuis plusieurs mois, l’application propose déjà une timeline avancée, des menus radiaux, le support du multi-touch, l’import/export de données ou encore un système de brosses. L’interface a manifestement fait l’objet d’un travail soigné ; les gauchers apprécieront au passage l’existence d’un mode dédié.

Le modèle économique retenu sera l’abonnement, avec un tarif assez léger (sous la barre des 5€/mois ou 50€/an).

D’ici le lancement effectif, une campagne kickstarter a été mise en place. L’idée est de financer le développement de certaines fonctions avant la mise à disposition publique de l’outil : une caméra 2D, un calque de transformations sont par exemple au menu.
Participer à la campagne ne vous donnera pas accès à l’outil, en revanche vous disposerez des fichiers d’animation utilisés dans les vidéos de présentation : de quoi partir sur de bonnes bases quand vous testerez l’outil par la suite.

L’article Callipeg : un outil d’animation 2D prometteur a besoin de vous est apparu en premier sur 3DVF.

Crowdfunding : un jeu vidéo inspiré des travaux de Moebius et Jodorowsky

Par Shadows

Adapter l’univers de Moebius et Jodorwsky en jeu vidéo : voilà un projet pour le moins ambitieux. C’est pourtant le défi que s’est lancé Ruiz Dupont Manuel alias Mata avec The Eyes of The Cat, une future expérience 3D inspirée de la BD du même nom.

Vous pourrez y contrôler un chat, un aigle et un enfant dans ce qui est décrit comme du “1 vs 1 vs 1” : une sorte de jeu d’échecs à trois joueurs, mais où vous incarnez chacun des joueurs.
Graphiquement, ce titre proposera trois partis pris correspondant aux trois avatars. Le tout sera créé sous Unreal Engine.

Pour boucler le projet, une levée de fonds a donc été mise en place sur Kickstarter. Le but, récolter au moins 8600$ : 1400 environ ont déjà été rassemblés. Un don de 12€ vous donnera accès à la version actuelle et finalisée du jeu, à une interview complète de Jodorowsky ou encore à des fonds d’écran.

Notez enfin que Mata dispose d’une solide expérience dans le jeu vidéo : il a eu l’occasion de travailler en tant que game director, technical artist (notamment chez Epic Games), mais aussi sur des projets temps réel chez Dassault.

Pour plus de détails, on consultera la campagne Kickstarter.

L’article Crowdfunding : un jeu vidéo inspiré des travaux de Moebius et Jodorowsky est apparu en premier sur 3DVF.

Le Fuffee Mug utilise la chaleur pour alimenter un écran qui sert à rien

Par Pierre Lecourt

Un mug avec un écran à encre électronique, voilà ce qu’il manquait à toute une génération d’utilisateurs. Ceux en manque de maximes débiles et  qui n’ont pas la chance de traîner sur Linkedin tous les matins pour déguster la laborieuse prose des génies qui y partagent leurs fabuleuses leçons de vie.

Le Fuffee Mug n’a qu’un intérêt, celui d’embarquer une technologie permettant de récupérer une partie de la chaleur dégagée par la boisson qu’il contient pour afficher des données sur son écran à encre numérique. A vrai dire rien de vraiment nouveau, on sait faire cela depuis un bon moment. Jean-Charles Peltier a découvert comment récupérer du courant à partir d’une source chaude en… 1834.

FU

Seulement JC n’avait pas l’esprit start-up et n’a donc pas eu le bonne idée de fabriquer un Mug qui pourrait afficher en gros “N’engueulez pas le pas Patron, la patronne s’en charge” directement sur un Fuffee. L’objet surfe sur une vague verte en insistant largement sur le fait qu’il est “battery-free”. Mon mug actuel l’est tout autant, il contient plus, est moins lourd et n’a aucune chance de se transformer un jour en un nouveau support de publicité.

Le pitch de la marque est assez clair “En exploitant l’énergie thermique d’un café, Fuffee devient un mug et une plateforme sociale sans piles qui vous permettra de coopérer avec diverses marques et services. Vous ressentirez quelque chose de différent à chaque fois  que vous boirez votre Fuffee”.1

FU

Dire que l’on est un produit vert en ajoutant une électronique inutile à un objet aussi simple qu’un Mug me parait un peu compliqué quand même. Mais si c’est pour gâcher mon café en m’apostrophant avec une publicité débile sur un énième nouveau support… Avec un message relayé en Bluetooth via mon smartphone qui pourrait tout aussi bien l’afficher lui même ? Ça c’est clairement une incitation au crime.

FU FU FU !

Je trouve cependant l’idée de base excellente et on peut imaginer des usages à cette relation chaleur – énergie pour un affichage à encre numérique. Nul besoin d’une source de chaleur permanente puisque l’écran continuera à afficher ses données même si la température redescend. Pour une station météo, un affichage d’informations importantes ayant une durée de vie assez longue, ce type d’interface est à réfléchir. On pourrait même imaginer un système de récupération de chaleur directement intégré à nos ordinateurs – qui en génèrent pas mal – pour afficher des données de cette manière.

Le Fuffee Mug est lancé à 69$, combien coûterait le même produit sans le mug pour des usages plus intelligents ?

Le Fuffee Mug utilise la chaleur pour alimenter un écran qui sert à rien © MiniMachines.net. 2020.

NDI Version Release Notes

Par rlsafran
I just downloaded the latest NDI Tools and always compare the file size to see if anything has changed. If you go to "C:\Program Files\NewTek\NDI 4 Tools\Scan Converter", for example, right mouse and look at properties -> details tab - you'll see a version number. The last version I downloaded was 4.1.4 and the latest is 4.1.6. It would be great if there was a readme file next to the download page link or in the NDI 4 Tools directory where you can find out what has changed, been fixed or is still a pending issue.

Thanks,
Rob

NDI Connect Update Compatibility with TC1 build 2020-01-16?

Par bwood
I recently updated my TC1 systems to the latest software (2020-01-16) and found today that it no longer works properly with the NewTek Connect application (19-07-03), going NDI to SDI. The output seems to be about 1 or more frames per second, instead of the 29.97 I am expecting (I'm in 1080i). Other sources (PTZ, Scan Converter, NewTek Connect on other system) are all still functional, just the newly updated TC1 systems are acting funny in Connect.

Is there a new version of NewTek Connect planned or available that works with the latest NDI package?

Thanks!

Studio Monitor Crashing on All Platforms

Par lonseidman
I downloaded the current version of NDI Tools to my Mac and two Windows PCs. Studio Monitor is crashing on all of them - is this a bug in the currently available version? Strange that two separate Windows PCs and a Mac will exhibit the same behavior.

UPDATE: Also it appears virtual input is crashing too. The Windows PCs are both running with Nvidia GPUs if that makes any difference.

Here is the error I'm seeing on the Mac:

Application Specific Information:
abort() called
terminating with uncaught exception of type Processing::NDI::Plugins::Lib::URL::parser::build_ error: Port defined, but host is empty

updating firmware on NDI-enabled Panasonic camera

Par rwzahora
We have an NDI-enabled Panasonic AW-HE40S that was installed by a vendor. The firmware for the camera is 1.82. Since the installation Panasonic has released two firmware updates, one of which may be useful to us.

Can we install the latest firmware without effecting the NDI capability or is new firmware from NewTek needed?

NDI - Native recording

Par Malapati
Hi,

could anyone point me in the right direction where I could read up more on TriCaster's new NDI native recording?

Some of the tech data aswell as what the additional "metadata" files that get recorded for each .mov clip, particularly on the TriCaster, are used for.

Thanks in advance.

NDI over VPN

Par adebeau
Hi team,
I have a specific event where I will have 2 different locations at 800m in a city, and I could not have a fiber or cable between the 2 sites.
The only thing I have is 2 x Internet Fiber boxes. So I am assuming having 200M between the 2 sites in VPN.

I am thinking about using NDI on a L2 VPN, but the 1st tests I have done are not positive ( I am using access manager to avoid discovery issues).
So I have a NDI SOurce ---VPN ---INTERNET ----- VPN ---- NDI Monitor

The result is that NDI monitor cannot play the source.

Is there anything mandatory in addition to full TCP/UDP access between NDI Source & Monitor ( I m not talking about broadcast IP for auto-discovery).

Any MTU issues ?

Will it work with a L3 VPN - without autodiscovery - ?

Is there any network spec on NDI protocol somewhere ?

many thanks,
PS: Of course NDI.cloud can help, but as the 2 internet boxes are on the same city :)

NDI Connect App - embedding audio

Par chrisaby
I installed the ndi connect app on my computer trying to embed a local audio source (mikrofone) to an ndi video source (NDI PTZ Camera).
I can see the local audiosource on the meter beside the video window, but when I want to control the embedded audio with ndi monitor I can't hear anything.
When trying the same thing with a local camera (not ndi) everything works fine... Is it possible that embedding audio only works with local video interfaces but not with incoming ndi sources?
Is that only possible with NDI Connect Pro?
I use the free NDI Connect App.


best
chrisaby

NDI Discovery Outside of Router

Par imryh
Hello.

Due to some issues, we've had to move our TC Mini and all connected BirdDog Studios to a small local router.
Everything is fine inside the router. Everyone discovers everyone.

I'm trying to get the TC Mini NDI to appear outside of the router too. So that other NDI devices on the bigger network can see it.

I've set up port forwarding on the router for ports 49152 - 65535. But still nothing.

Any ideas how to get that to work?

Thanks.

Imry

Tools 4 Access Manager question and comment

Par marksctv
In preparation for a cross subnet W10 PC to PC NDI connection for production this summer, I downloaded NDI Tools 4 and started experimenting. I have VLC/NDI running on one PC with the receiver on a different subnet being StudioMonitor. It's working well. But I noticed that even after reboots of both PC's, I no longer need to run Access Manager. Can I get an explanation of where the path info is saved on the receiving PC. Also, the Access Manager executable needs to be signed to avoid the "unknown publisher" message. If the user is running as a Windows user rather than administrator, the user needs to enter an administrator's userid and password which is not allowed in our installation.
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